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About open sauce

#21 User is offline   RabbitFood 

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 12:14 AM

View PostCirkuitBreaker, on 17 February 2015 - 10:05 PM, said:

Except make changes to Halo's physics. Because if Open Sauce could do that, SPv3 would take even longer to come out because the OS team would be implementing Havok or PhysX. And then everyone would rejoice.


Some things are hardcoded into the game anyway.

#22 User is offline   Rambo 

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 01:18 AM

yeah, but you can "update" things like Netcode, etc.

#23 User is offline   CirkuitBreaker 

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 01:43 AM

If only the Netcode was good enough for cooperative campaign play.

#24 User is offline   Rambo 

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 02:22 AM

ell, here's the problem I see with thsat.

Are you familiar with the Bridge in etcode?

Thereare two bridges, and they have to bridged by aq third bridge.

Proven fact in scripting.

There is a client bridge, and a server bridge.

Stuff client-side has a hard time going server-side.

Stuff server-side goes easdier to client than tthe other way around.

There is a bridge for client and for server, which needs to be properly linked.

With Open Sauce, we can do this, BUT it will take tie as well as proper resources.

#25 User is offline   RabbitFood 

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 02:29 AM

View PostRambo, on 18 February 2015 - 02:22 AM, said:

ell, here's the problem I see with thsat.

Are you familiar with the Bridge in etcode?

Thereare two bridges, and they have to bridged by aq third bridge.

Proven fact in scripting.

There is a client bridge, and a server bridge.

Stuff client-side has a hard time going server-side.

Stuff server-side goes easdier to client than tthe other way around.

There is a bridge for client and for server, which needs to be properly linked.

With Open Sauce, we can do this, BUT it will take tie as well as proper resources.


Assuming you mean the current version of Open Sauce, from what I've seen while messing around with the program you'd be incorrect. Besides, no one wants to spend the time to actually do that for a 14 year old game.

#26 User is offline   Masterz1337 

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 04:14 AM

Why have havoc when you have H1's awesome physics engine. I'd take what we have over the other games any day.

#27 User is offline   CirkuitBreaker 

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 04:49 AM

Care to explain why you feel this way, Masterz? I'd like to hear what you have to say so I can formulate a better response. It's also possible that you'll change my mind. :)

#28 User is offline   Masterz1337 

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 05:56 AM

The physics in later games were more realistic but I don't think many would say they were more fun. H1's are fun and while floaty they always lead to interesting results when explosives and collisions are involved. Every game since H2 has tried to bring the physics back to a more H1 feel, even 343 with H4.

I don't really get the hype of people wanting ragdoll either through havoc, I prefer the more brutal H1 deaths than the sometimes silly ragdolls. Another thing h4 did as well which was pretty cool with it's Covenant.

#29 User is offline   CirkuitBreaker 

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 06:16 PM

:| I really expected a longer post.

First of all, I'll admit I'm not very familiar with physics engines in general. I do not know what the limitations of Halo 1's physics are, and I'm not aware of what advantages a newer, more robust physics engine would bring. But there are things about Halo 1's physics that frustrate me to no end, like when a rocket hits a banshee, it just goes down. The rocket does not seem to impart any kinetic energy into the banshee. And then there's the fact that if a vehicle lightly touches me, an enemy, or a fellow marine, it counts as a splatter. The floatiness of covenant vehicles just feels weird in general. And my understanding is that mancannons and gravity lifts are currently impossible.

Neither Halo 1's nor Halo 2's physics were my favorite. I actually liked Reach's the best.

I'll agree with you that premade death animations look better than ragdolls, but I would like more death animations for any given death scenario. Honestly what I'd really like to see in a Halo game is destructible environments. If a stream of plasma caused rock or metal to just boil away like in the books, I would probably piss myself. I would be terrified and delighted at the same time.

This post has been edited by CirkuitBreaker: 18 February 2015 - 06:18 PM


#30 User is offline   RabbitFood 

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 09:15 PM

View PostCirkuitBreaker, on 18 February 2015 - 06:16 PM, said:

:| I really expected a longer post.

First of all, I'll admit I'm not very familiar with physics engines in general. I do not know what the limitations of Halo 1's physics are, and I'm not aware of what advantages a newer, more robust physics engine would bring. But there are things about Halo 1's physics that frustrate me to no end, like when a rocket hits a banshee, it just goes down. The rocket does not seem to impart any kinetic energy into the banshee. And then there's the fact that if a vehicle lightly touches me, an enemy, or a fellow marine, it counts as a splatter. The floatiness of covenant vehicles just feels weird in general. And my understanding is that mancannons and gravity lifts are currently impossible.

Neither Halo 1's nor Halo 2's physics were my favorite. I actually liked Reach's the best.

I'll agree with you that premade death animations look better than ragdolls, but I would like more death animations for any given death scenario. Honestly what I'd really like to see in a Halo game is destructible environments. If a stream of plasma caused rock or metal to just boil away like in the books, I would probably piss myself. I would be terrified and delighted at the same time.


I'm short on time n' maybe I'll come back to this later, but I can say right now that there are working man-cannons and gravity lifts that use O.S instead of the old "insert force" trick.

#31 User is offline   Masterz1337 

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 11:31 PM

Yeah the Gravity and man cannons have nothing to do with the more modern physics engines. Things like the banshee can be done, but that is the way banshee physics were set up as well as the basnhees own momentum. You see the rockets momentum effect things like the warthog all the time. Our rockets actually do impact damage and splash damage, so if you hit something directly it will generate more force and damage. Again, the vehicles tapping the player lightly is just a damage value that we've adjusted, so that isn't an issue anymore. Each game since 2 has also gone back to making vehicle impact damage higher and more like H1 too, just another interesting reversal that's been going on in the series. Halo 2 was really a mess when it came to vehicle collisions and splatters, I have a few of them on my Xbox One video share whatever from the MCC where you can see how bad it was (and it was just as bad on the original xbox as well).

As far as covenant floatyness, it isn't really something that has to be the way it is, but I wasn't a fan of the direction they went with having them be super heavy in H2. They were a lot cooler when you could do wheelies in them.

Havoc is no doubt more realistic and more capable, but from a gameplay perspective for vehicles I don't really enjoy it. When it comes to debris from vehicles, environments, and scenery objects, it is a very nice thing to have. It be really nice to have 2 physics engines running, one for the visual fluff and one for the vehicles but I doubt we will see that happen.

edit: Destroyable environments was something that was announced for H2 and ended up just being a very rare part of the game in a handful of locations. But I agree it would be very cool to have and the fact that it was dropped after H2 makes me sad, as it's one of the few things I like about H2. You can see a little bit of it in old mombassa, the new mombassa bridge the gravity pillars in high charity, and in the last room with the brutes in Great Journey.

This post has been edited by Masterz1337: 18 February 2015 - 11:39 PM


#32 User is offline   CirkuitBreaker 

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Posted 19 February 2015 - 12:21 AM

So other than debris from destroyed objects, you can do everything you need or want to do with the current physics engine?

#33 User is offline   Masterz1337 

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Posted 19 February 2015 - 12:55 AM

It's hard to say, I'd love to have all our covenant crates and smaller scenery objects move from explosions, but we'd need a new tag type and other things to make that happen, a new physics engine wouldn't matter at this point. How things react with it all.. it's hard to say. But SPV2 TSC had lots of crates that were placed as vehicles and it worked really well from what I remember.

#34 User is offline   ericlol 

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Posted 19 February 2015 - 03:34 AM

Yup! The crates from TSC SPv2 worked really well. I used it to get out of the map because of the non-opening door glitch.

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